Tag Archive for 'Churchrelevance.com'

Driscoll & The Wink Club

Back in September, Mark Driscoll, Pastor of Mars Hill Church, shared a message at the Convergent Conference at the Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary.

In it, he targeted the views of Brian McLaren, Doug Pagitt and Rob Bell. While I have very little respect for McLaren and Pagitt, Rob Bell I don’t know too much of and haven’t made up my mind on yet.

But what bugs me most about this Emergent crowd is the constant need to question everything. For example, Rob Bell, in his book “Velvet Elvis: Repainting The Christian Faith,” he writes:

“What if tomorrow someone digs up definitive proof that Jesus had a real, earthly, biological father named Larry, and archaeologists find Larry’s tomb and do DNA samples and prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that the virgin birth was really just a bit of mythologizing the Gospel writers threw in to appeal to the followers of the Mithra and Dionysian religious cults that were hugely popular at the time of Jesus, whose gods had virgin births? But what if as you study the origin of the word virgin, you discover that the word virgin in the gospel of Matthew actually comes from the book of Isaiah, and then you find out that in the Hebrew language at that time, the word virgin could mean several things. And what if you discover that in the first century being “born of a virgin” also referred to a child whose mother became pregnant the first time she had intercourse?”

This is a disturbing view in my mind and totally contradicts scripture as early as Genesis 3 where God talks about the “seed of the woman” - way before any Mithra’s or Dionysian cults ever existed. Any serious Bible student would know that God is alluding to a mysterious event here as genealogies in Scripture are usually discussed along male lines and not female.

Furthermore, Bell seems to belittle the Isaiah 7 passage regarding the virgin birth in his attempt to address this issue and ultimately pokes a finger in the face of the Gospel account. To me, the pursuit to reach the unchurched is not worth it is you trash scripture. After all, even God exalts His Word - even more then His Name.

But out of the three Driscoll targets, Bell is the least of my concerns. It’s McLaren and Pagitt who concern me in their views and activism within Christianity today. Form your own opinion of what Driscoll says. Here is the iTunes podcast link for the conference and have a listen to what Driscoll has to say.

2 Well it seems as if the Emergent movement has had it’s feathers ruffled as a result of this and a series of bloggers have formed a “wink club.” Fuelled by people like Adam Walker from pomomusings.com, this group of bloggers are posting a series of “wink” posts at Driscoll to show their dissatisfaction at Driscoll for what he shared at the above mentioned conference.

OK, now here’s my rant. This wink club - take it’s collective ability and impact and it doesn’t register a blimp on the radar of influence or impact in changing lives. This group of “bloggers” are emergent friendly and tend to pledge their allegiance to McLaren et al and their rebellious questioning of everything done in the name of Christianity.

Sure, there are heaps of stupid things done in the name of Christianity and the modern church needs to change in order to address this. But to question scripture and to modernise it in a way to embrace all kinds of whacked out ideas makes this group akin to the mindset of the people from the ‘Jesus Seminar” where the Gospel is assessed according to modern ideas as to what Jesus actually said and done based on a humanistic and carnal attitude.

The net effect of this this movement is to assess the life of Christ and to categorise the probability of the events actually happening to red, pink, grey or black “beads” of probability of these events actually happening.

The result of this is that the vast majority of the life and teachings of Christ are ultimately questioned instead of believed. Bell’s quote above is an example of the same attitude within the emergent movement.

Driscoll on the other hand has distanced himself from this movement. Initially a part of the movement, he tore away from it alarmed at where this group was heading. He now pastors a 6000 plus church and is among the fastest growing and most influential churches in the USA.

Among the reasons for this is that Driscoll holds Scripture in high regard. He often gets slammed for his stance of “God says it, we need to obey.” Apparently, those in the emergent movement forget the words uttered by Paul:

“We destroy arguments and every lofty opinion raised against the knowledge of God, and take every thought captive to obey Christ,” 2 Cor 10:5

So to the winkers I say;

I know much of what WE as the church represent is questionable to an unbelieving world and I know that we have been a bad example.

But in our attempt to converse with them, we need not attack those who hold on to scripture in high regard for even our God places His Word higher then even His Name.

For example, Adam at pomomusings lists a bunch of “ridiculous” snippets from Driscoll’s message and one of them is:

“If Rabbis don’t love Jesus, they have a bad hermeneutic.”

Well Adam, you are a student of scripture and you should take note of the following passage where Jesus says:

“You diligently study the Scriptures because you think that by them you possess eternal life. These are the Scriptures that testify about me, yet you refuse to come to me to have life.” John 5:39-40

So if a Rabbi does not love Jesus, he indeed does have a bad hermeneutic. You bring that up with Jesus if you have a problem with that - not Driscoll.

You winkers amount to pretty much nothing in the grand scheme of things and have very little impact on spreading the Gospel. Driscoll does. So get over it.

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America’s Top 50 Influential Churches

If you’re a church geek like me, you will love this list of America’s top 50 churches. Thanks to the work done at churchrelevance.com, I am able to compile this list of the most influential churches based on the following on the following criteria:

Being innovative, growing, multiplying and influential gives a church a huge ability to impact the lives of a culture dead to Jesus. And so I salute these churches - and more importantly the Authority behind each church. Many of them I have serious concerns about what they talk about - aka their theology. But nevertheless, this is the church - albeit on the other side of the world from me. Make sure to check out the geographical and denominational breakdown at The Church Report website.

On a personal note, I enjoy seeing Mars Hill Church rising up these kinds of lists. Although it’s lead Pastor, Mark Driscoll, cops so much crap from so many people, he is one of my favourite pastors and I enjoy his teaching immensely.

Another favourite of mine is Mosaic Church and the teachings or Erwin McManus - another guy who cops a lot of crap from the masses only because his heart is sold out to God instead of man. Also good to see LifeChurch.tv up there as usual.

If this list isn’t enough for you:

  • Click here to access America’s Top 25 Multiplying Churches.
  • Click here for churchrelevance.com’s article on 250+ churches to watch based on their inclusions on lists such as above.

The Top 50 Influential Churches In The US.

  1. Willow Creek Community Church | Bill Hybels
  2. Saddleback Church | Rick Warren
  3. Fellowship Church | Ed Young Jr.
  4. North Point Community Church | Andy Stanley
  5. LifeChurch.tv | Craig Groeschel
  6. Granger Community Church | Mark Beeson
  7. Lakewood Church | Joel Osteen
  8. Mars Hill Church | Mark Driscoll
  9. The Potter’s House | T.D. Jakes
  10. Seacoast Church | Greg Surratt
  11. Mosaic Church | Erwin McManus
  12. Mars Hill Bible Church | Rob Bell
  13. North Coast Church | Larry Osborn
  14. First Assembly of God | Tommy Barnett
  15. The Church of the Resurrection | Adam Hamilton
  16. Southeast Christian Church | Dave Stone
  17. The Brooklyn Tabernacle | Jim Cymbala
  18. Calvary Chapel | Bob Coy
  19. Community Christian Church | Dave Ferguson
  20. New Hope Christian Fellowship | Wayne Cordero
  21. NewSpring Community Church | Perry Noble
  22. Prestonwood Baptist Church | Jack Graham
  23. Redeemer Presbyterian Church | Timothy Keller
  24. Second Baptist Church | Ed Young Sr.
  25. Mariners Church | Kenton Beshore
  26. Bayside Covenant Church | Ray Johnston
  27. Calvary Chapel | Chuck Smith
  28. Christ Fellowship | Tom Mullins
  29. First Baptist Church | Mac Brunson
  30. First Baptist Church | Johnny Hunt
  31. Menlo Park Presbyterian Church | John Ortberg
  32. New Life Church | Ross Parsley – Interim Senior Pastor
  33. NorthRidge Church | Brad Powell
  34. Thomas Road Baptist Church | Jonathan Falwell
  35. Wooddale Church | Leith C. Anderson
  36. Harvest Christian Fellowship | Greg Laurie
  37. Northland - A Church Distributed | Joel Hunter
  38. Bellevue Baptist Church | Steve Gaines
  39. National Community Church | Mark Batterson
  40. Crystal Cathedral | Robert A. Schuller
  41. World Changers | Creflo Dollar
  42. Fellowship of the Woodlands | Kerry Shook
  43. Vineyard Community Church | David Workman
  44. New Birth Baptist Church | Eddie L. Long
  45. Oak Hills Church | Max Lucado
  46. Bethlehem Baptist | John Piper
  47. New Light Christian Center Church | Ira Hilliard
  48. First Baptist Church | Jack Schaap
  49. McLean Bible Church | Lon Solomon
  50. LA International Church / Dream Center | Matthew Barnett / Tommy Barnett

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